Light Rail on One Way

kancamagus · May 23, 2010, 02:58:49 AM

Is this possible to create puzzle pieces for one-way light rail on a one-way road? This is a popular means of implementing light rail in major cities where two existing roads (usually one block apart) aren't wide enough for bi-directional light rail right of way, so one direction light rail is put on one block and the other direction is put on one block over. Usually the roads this is installed on are also one way. I drew a graphic show what this might look like. I drew it with three travel lanes (one shared streetcar/cars), plus a bike lane and on-street parking before I realized this might be tough to fit on one tile. Should have drew it with only two lanes like a normal one-way road... oh well.

If this is possible, and if on street parking (eye-candy via T21 props) and an eye-candy bike lane aren't too difficult to add on, this would really up the realism of the GLR and make it "future proof" for all the cities currently studying/pursuing funding to build similar streetcars.

Inspired by Portland Streetcar:

shanghai kid · May 23, 2010, 04:30:22 AM

if possible, this would be cool to see in SC4

JoeST · May 23, 2010, 04:32:17 AM

I believe the main issue would be mirroring etc. it gets quite messy....

kancamagus · May 23, 2010, 10:27:15 AM

Quote from: JoeST on May 23, 2010, 04:32:17 AM
I believe the main issue would be mirroring etc. it gets quite messy....

If the streetcar lane is always on the right side of a one-way road tile, then how would it be messy?

You would be able to know which direction traffic and the streetcars would travel in just by looking at the puzzle piece, due to the streetcar tracks being off center.

BigSlark · May 23, 2010, 03:01:22 PM

I've often wondered about this myself, it would be a neat tool for CBD's.

My "local" instance of this on New Orleans' St. Charles Avenue line, the one-way couplet with St. Charles and Carondelet runs the wrong way for a left-hand drive country.
[http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&source=s_q&hl=en&geocode=&q=tivoli+circle+new+orleans,+la&sll=29.952936,-90.00736&sspn=0.006749,0.013937&ie=UTF8&hq=tivoli+circle&hnear=New+Orleans,+LA&ll=29.943345,-90.071339&spn=0.001687,0.004506&t=h&z=19]Lee Circle[/url]
This traffic circle will get much busier in the next decade as there is a new streetcar line being put in on Howard Avenue/Andrew Higgins/St. Joseph. The New Orleans Regional Transit Authority has found that New Orleanians actually use the streetcars more than tourists and are going to expand the system with an eye towards public transit...imagine that.

Peace,
Kevin

sim-al2 · May 23, 2010, 10:01:10 PM

He means that some one-ways will look strange because the game does... weird stuff with intersections sometimes. I think it would be much easier to do if the track was in the center.

RogerRon91 · May 25, 2010, 08:40:42 AM

Hey kancamagus

Great idea! At the moment, the SFBT-Team discuss about the GLR-Oneway-System.

A problem is, that the people in Great Britian drive on the left. In Germany and in the USA (as well as in many other countries) you drive on the right. I think, we prefer the vision "drive on the right". I hope, the people in Great Britian do not take it personal.

Diggis · May 25, 2010, 08:54:26 AM

Quote from: kancamagus on May 23, 2010, 10:27:15 AM
If the streetcar lane is always on the right side of a one-way road tile, then how would it be messy?

You would be able to know which direction traffic and the streetcars would travel in just by looking at the puzzle piece, due to the streetcar tracks being off center.

Because the game has no concept of left or right. The direction you drag the tile has a large impact on the way textures show up. This is especially noticeable at T intersections and which the game tends to flip or mirror a lot. This would result in the possible having the track on the left in one part and the right in another.

j-dub · May 25, 2010, 10:33:36 AM

So then why is this a problem with puzzle pieces?

sim-al2 · May 25, 2010, 01:32:37 PM

I don't think it would be. I still think that having the track in the center would be a good "median" between left and right-hand drive.

It would also require less puzzle pieces. But I agree that it would better to have on one side for realism.

Tarkus · May 25, 2010, 01:53:08 PM

Quote from: kancamagus on May 23, 2010, 10:27:15 AM
If the streetcar lane is always on the right side of a one-way road tile, then how would it be messy?

Asymmetry with the intersections. If you have the tracks on one side or the other, you'll need several different configurations as the radius of the track curves and their alignment through the intersections will change depending on which way the track is turning.

Additionally, at least in the case of the Portland system, right-side-of-the-One-Way-Road isn't always the rule. It is on the right side on 10th and 11th, but along Market Street, the tracks are actually on the left side of the road, I'd presume due to the turning radius. Bi-directional pathing on non-intersection pieces might be the answer there, though you'd have to be careful how the intersections are done on that end.

I don't think right/left-hand-drive would really be much of an issue, though . . . basically flip the puzzle piece's pathing upside down for LHD, and voila.

Quote from: sim-al2 on May 25, 2010, 01:32:37 PM
I don't think it would be. I still think that having the track in the center would be a good "median" between left and right-hand drive. It would also require less puzzle pieces. But I agree that it would better to have on one side for realism.

Not to mention it'd probably be kinda dangerous.

-Alex

sim-al2 · May 25, 2010, 02:21:49 PM

Well the way I was thinking of it would be like T-RAM but one track and on one-way road.

OwlGreene · June 07, 2010, 08:58:08 AM

I posted about my desire to see something like this a few months ago and was appalled at the proverbial attacks I received from members saying there "isn't enough interest in something like this". I really hope it gets figured out, it's a good idea, and it exists in real life in many cities. The benefit of course is being able to terminate a line without an unrealistic turnaround. Only place I've seen a real turnaround is Philly. Who can push this forward?

RogerRon91 · June 07, 2010, 12:15:13 PM

You may rest assured that the project is not finished. At the moment we are discussing about the different traffic routings. It takes a little bit time to create some textures - is not so simple to create an OWR-GLR-System

It will work out all right.

kj3400 · June 07, 2010, 03:23:55 PM

Quote from: Tarkus on May 25, 2010, 01:53:08 PM
Asymmetry with the intersections. If you have the tracks on one side or the other, you'll need several different configurations as the radius of the track curves and their alignment through the intersections will change depending on which way the track is turning.

Additionally, at least in the case of the Portland system, right-side-of-the-One-Way-Road isn't always the rule. It is on the right side on 10th and 11th, but along Market Street, the tracks are actually on the left side of the road, I'd presume due to the turning radius. Bi-directional pathing on non-intersection pieces might be the answer there, though you'd have to be careful how the intersections are done on that end.

That's true. In my hometown (Baltimore), the light rail usually stays on the left, but at one point it'll have the road switch places with the northbound track, with the road between the tracks. Not to mention that both directions of track are on the same road.

If having the track in the middle is kinda dangerous, what about having the road in the middle?

OwlGreene · June 13, 2010, 05:37:38 PM

@KJ3400 You're talking about Howard Street right?

This always seemed weird to me, the configuration of the tracks for the Lexington Market stations. I doubt there'd be a good application for the Howard config in SC4, but certainly something would help.

Kitsune · June 13, 2010, 05:51:10 PM

Why not have the tracks on both sides? There's instance's of one-way street's in Toronto (York St comes to mind) that have double tracks from days when the road was two way, and one track really no longer connects to anything. I guess that's the byproduct of having a street car system for almost a century (if not longer).

samerton · July 27, 2010, 07:48:55 AM

I'd love that! But it would be hard to make, as there would be lots of puzzle pieces needed.

Ryuji Long · November 21, 2010, 02:43:40 PM

Speaking of dangerous, that pic in the OP really surprises me. When I lived in Portland 15 years ago you weren't allowed to drive on the tracks. Having since lived in San Diego, CA and Denver, CO where one way streets have light rail tracks (like in the pic above) but you're not allowed to drive on the tracks!

travismking · November 21, 2010, 04:39:27 PM

I live in baltimore as well and the Light Rails track pattern is kinda stupid, just like myself... too many accidents are caused by stupid drivers hitting the train :p