T21 on SAM question

xannepan · May 20, 2013, 06:10:06 AM

Hi NAM team,

A few questions about SAM:

Is it possible to add different T21 props to each SAM variation? Secondly, how many SAM variations does the game allow?

Reason for asking: I am wondering if I could mis-use the SAM to create draggable fences (no SAM texture, no paths needed, just T21s)...

Thanks,
Alex

Magneto · May 20, 2013, 09:54:38 AM

Very interersting idea!
I'm not from the team but I'll answer anyway:

1. Yes. If you look in your SAM folder, you'll see already existing T21s for the differents sets.
2. As many as NAM see fit. Currently 16 sets can coexist. Look for the 6th digit of the network IDs: it will give you the SAM type. Japanese streets recently took spot A, so you still have B to F range

Diggis · May 20, 2013, 12:09:09 PM

Quote from: xannepan on May 20, 2013, 06:10:06 AM
Hi NAM team,

A few questions about SAM:

Is it possible to add different T21 props to each SAM variation? Secondly, how many SAM variations does the game allow?

Reason for asking: I am wondering if I could mis-use the SAM to create draggable fences (no SAM texture, no paths needed, just T21s)...

Thanks,
Alex

As best I can tell, Magneto's answers are pretty spot on.

What you are suggesting could possibly work, however, one thing that will cause problems would be making them slope friendly. Making the fence a network model would be better as they stretch with the lot, but I'm not sure how they work.

cogeo · May 20, 2013, 01:54:48 PM

I have made a more slope-friendly version of the fence used in jeronij's walls (Muros Piedra). Take a look here (click on the image to zoom). The model is 8m long (instead of the original 16m), ie two props are needed for each tile, which makes it possible to use them in more slopped networks without having the one end buried underground and the other one hanging into the air. I could make them available to you if you are interested.

Network models follow the terrain variations - just look closely at a stretch of monorail track laid on slopped and anomalous terrain (without a slope mod installed) to see what I mean. These models need to be 1-Z/R though, as 20-Z/R models can't be manipulated by the game. You need a program capable of producing 1-Z/R output for this, but I think you can construct such a model by editing and combining certain views of a 20-ZR one, eg take the 0x#####420 S3D, rotate it by 180° and append it to the 0x#####400 one.

xannepan · May 20, 2013, 11:08:29 PM

1-Z/R models are not a problem for me to create (my animals all are 1-Z/R models) and I am sure I can make them slope friendly... I was thinking more along the lines of the SNM security fences. These models are fairly simple so should be easy to re-create as 1-Z/R.

Good that you mention the 1-Z/R limitation though. I didn't take that into account in my initial idea. It will mean if it works the concept works, it would be limited to fairly simple models and such for the T21 props.

One other question. Would it be possible to define a t21 prop family set, in order to produce some random variation?

noahclem · May 22, 2013, 02:28:55 AM

Unless I'm remembering very incorrectly T21s are able to utilize prop families.

xannepan · May 22, 2013, 03:17:45 AM

Thanks Noah... I'll check it out.. I'm putting this project on hold for a bit. As always I underestimate how much time modding takes... You'd think I should have learned by now

Tarkus · May 22, 2013, 11:09:14 AM

They are able to take prop families. The last version I made of my unfinished "Signage Piece Mod" used prop families for the signs.

-Alex

cogeo · May 22, 2013, 02:06:10 PM

Quote from: xannepan on May 20, 2013, 11:08:29 PM
1-Z/R models are not a problem for me to create (my animals all are 1-Z/R models) and I am sure I can make them slope friendly... I was thinking more along the lines of the SNM security fences. These models are fairly simple so should be easy to re-create as 1-Z/R.

Good that you mention the 1-Z/R limitation though. I didn't take that into account in my initial idea. It will mean if it works the concept works, it would be limited to fairly simple models and such for the T21 props.

One other question. Would it be possible to define a t21 prop family set, in order to produce some random variation?

Props in T21s are ordinary props, so they can be prop families as well. I have used prop-families in my Fenced GLR Puzzle Pieces (a NAM plugin), not for variety though, but instead to make it possible to use (and select) different fence props from the installed set. These props can be 20-Z/R or 1-Z/R, but they are not aligned to the terrain, as network models do, instead they are either skewed, or stay upright (depending on the Orient To Slope property).

Network models are different though, they must be 1-Z/R, and they are not props used in T21s, instead they are defined in the network exemplars.

It might be more efficient to combine the front and back faces of an existing (exported) 20-Z/R model (eg the SNM) to make up a 1-Z/R one, instead of making it from the start, as an exported fence model usually has a very simple structure (several orthogonal faces only - the LODshell), while an original 1-Z/R one may contain an awful big number of faces (for all those posts, wires or what), thus putting a burden on the graphics engine.