EA answer to How To Install the game.

[luvs2draw]

Hello everyone,

I've enclosed EA's answer to how to install SC4 from purchased CD's. It doesn't work. I tried to install mine and confuses me how a EA Tech (someone who should know how) send's limited information on how to install the game from CD's. First thing I noticed was it doesn't tell you when to enter the Product Key.

If someone can get it to work that would be Great, but it didn't work for me.

[mgb204]

I'm not sure why you need instructions, doesn't the installer tell you what you need to do and when? For example, when the installer asks you to input the product key, that's when you need to do that. The point being it should be a straightforward process, except if you come across a problem or error. If that is what you are having an issue with, then it would be much easier to help you if you could explain what is not working as it should.

If you've completed the installation process without error, but the game will not run, that is a completely different problem altogether. I would note if you have a fully patched and up to date version of Windows Vista, 7, 8 or 8.1, then you will NOT get the CD version to work. Similarly if you use Windows 10, the disk version will never work, the difference being previous versions have a workaround, but Windows 10 does not.

[luvs2draw]

I had the game installed on a computer running Window's 7 and had no problem's running or installing the game. Now I am running Window's 10 and in no way can I get it to play the game, tried running in an Admin account and it didn't run, tried to changed the compatibility to run in Windows 7 still no luck. I downloaded the game from GoG and the game runs fine.

[Indiana Joe]

Microsoft has disabled the ability to run games from CD that use old DRM (Digital Rights Management; basically anti-piracy measures).  They found a security loophole and all updated versions of Windows will currently block the CDs from working.

Many games from the early 2000's are affected and they no longer receive updates from their publishers, so the best solution is to buy a digital download copy, as you already have.

This whole thing didn't exactly hit front page news; since the huge rise of digital distribution platforms, like Steam and others, most video game copies have been sold as digital media for many years now, and CDs are going the way of Floppy Discs.

[Seaman]

In case someone's reading this in search for help and they have a pre-Windows10 operating system, here's a workaround if you don't want to buy a game twice: unlike Windows 10, where they didn't include the Safedisc driver in the first place, Windows 7/8 still has the driver but it was disabled by update KB3086255, released in September 2015.

You can enable it manually with the caveat that this ignores microsoft's security recommendations. Here's the link to Microsoft's support for this issue and a guide how to (re-)enable it.

[fantozzi]

Just a question, I don't own win10.

If I understood well it's about the macrovision driver 'secdrv.sys' called when starting the game (exe) to check if the original cd is present in the local drive. This procedure can be used to launch malicious code and therefore was blocked by MS. So the game won't launch.

To me it seems illegal to circumvent the procedure f.e. by modifing the game's exe or to emulate a 'fake DRM'. But ...

Macrovision Corporation. perhaps more known for his video protection technologies,  became Rovi and in 2016 purchased TiVo Inc and then changed name to TivoInc (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TiVo_Corporation). As they changed business several times to my knowledge there are no official site about SafeDisk left and there is no offical support on SafeDisk anymore (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SafeDisc#History). As far as I can see, it is an abbandoned technology.

I immediatly understand that no company wants to support abbandoned security technology. But I guess, Tivo Inc should be the (copyright-)owner of this technology, not Microsoft.

So imho, you can't blame Microsoft for this.

But on the other hand I'd like to ask:

To my knowledge you can sign drivers for win10 for personal use (not officially) by using the WDK? Did someone try this? Or you can expel signing on drivers?

As most probably the driver itself 'secdrv.sys' is not owned/protected by MS but was given away for free by Macrovision to the companies using the SafeDisk-DRM technology on their Media. So it was always a piece of freeware? At least one had to know ...

And this could be the reason, why this question wasn't answered so far:

https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/windows_10-hardware-winpc/installing-safedisc-driver-on-windows-10/c27e1f27-1f69-4529-99d8-a3f4b2a856e3

Don't know, just another silly thought.

[mgb204]

Ultimately secdrv.sys is a driver file, the licensing terms of which reside with the owner of the code. The term abandonware is not a legal one and would afford you no protection against prosecution for violation of copyright or EULA etc. People seem to think it means fair use applies, but the reality is that so called abandonware is usually just not on anyone's radar or with sufficient financial incentive to take action against individuals not profiting from such usage.

Is the issue here MS or Macrovision?, well it's a little bit of both. See MS say there is a security hole, but frankly that's a little too neat. I said it at the time, why would MS only remove it just as the preview builds roll over to the final one on Win10? Then remove it via an update on older systems. One could easily see a business case for that far more than any minor security issue. MS say Macrovision should update the driver, knowing full well they won't. Macrovision say the drivers were MS's responsibility and that they should update the code, which isn't in their interests. But none of that means a thing, the only important factor in all this is that consumers don't care enough, so MS neither need to support this tech nor justify a thing. It's a little odd, considering the long standing nature of backwards compatibility for PCs that there was so little fuss at this huge blow to old games. Many of which have no digital re-release to bring back from the dead.

If you can find the file (which simply requires having access to an older revision of Windows), you can easily copy it. Is that legal?, honestly it's a quagmire and I very much doubt MS would like to comment on it. But as explained above, they don't have to, no one cares. However, having done so, yes you can digitally sign it for use with your O/S. You can then set a small script that enables the driver, runs the game, then swiftly disables it again. That's pretty much the ideal solution for Win Vista - 8.1 users IMHO too. The security risks are marginal at best and your old games will work fine without illegal workarounds. Is doing that easy for the average user, you bet it isn't. It must be done on a per-system basis, so there is no way to distribute a working version for Win10. If MS really don't want this, should it become prevalent, you could expect to see the OS updated to block all attempts at using the driver.

Honestly, if this is only an issue relating to SC4, buy a digital copy, from GoG (or other DRM-Free vendors), if you can grasp that DRM is what ultimately killed your disks. Because DRM in all it's various forms is bad and should be avoided. Or you could buy a new DRM version, then wait and see what magic will break that in future too. People once thought this kind of DRM was harmless, but history proves otherwise. However, if you've many affected games, I don't know if replacing them is really a solution, so I'd look to find some workaround personally. If anything this should be a wake up call, we're sleepwalking into a new digital age where content is controlled by those selling it. Of course nothing nefarious will happen, I mean corporations are nice guys, right? It's less about consumer rights, but think about the history of content. It's the digital equivalent of burning down libraries, destroying the past in an attempt to make money. When our games, which are part of our culture, really deserve to be preserved in some form.

[fantozzi]

Don't know what you mean by the word 'abandoned ware' regarding the matter?

At least until 2008, last version (4.3.86.0) of secdrv.sys was available as a free download on the macrovision website. Now you talking about 'abandoned ware' one could think you're trying to put words into my mouth. I can't see the point. So if it's possible to you, please stop those subliminal vilification of other peoples posts.

So to clarify again - it seems to me it is a piece of freeware.

Second - what I really don't get: you do a long explanation just to end with recommending a particular online seller as the easiest way to solve the problems with win10 (not shure if so much advertisment is really needed here)  - but then adding a speech about people having to preserve this, our culture. So what was the proposal again? To defend culture - to keep the game up running - is all about choosing the right seller? Or what exactly? To depict the 'quagmire' part of this culture? Didn't get the message but those last sentences sound ridiculous to me.

[mgb204]

Don't know what you mean by the word 'abandoned ware' regarding the matter?

Abandonware, it's a thing and whilst you didn't mention it specifically, I'm sure many would have been thinking along those lines. You could Google the term if you don't understand it's meaning? It's relevant in context however...

At least until 2008, last version (4.3.86.0) of secdrv.sys was available as a free download on the macrovision website. Now you talking about 'abandoned ware' one could think you're trying to put words into my mouth. I can't see the point. So if it's possible to you, please stop those subliminal vilification of other peoples posts.

So to clarify again - it seems to me it is a piece of freeware.

And here's the rub, I'm not putting words in your mouth, but the assumption this is freeware comes from where exactly? Does the licence explicitly state it's freeware? In reality this is proprietary commercial software that was given away to end users without cost, but that does not mean it's freeware. In fact one could argue you were paying for it, like many Windows components, it's all covered by the cost of the Windows licence, with Microsoft handling the licensing of third party elements, of which there are many.

In fact assuming something is freeware shows a ridiculously simplistic understanding of software licensing, almost everything is licensed for use, there is rarely any ownership involved. So what it all comes down to, is not whether you can obtain it without cost, but what the explicit licence states you can and can't do with it. Not being able to find such a licence, does not mean one didn't exist, in fact one would have existed, of that you can be certain. Many people will use the term abandonware to describe a software product, that is either no longer supported or available. It's another common but false assumption that just because something isn't supported, users can do what they like with it.

I'm simply pointing out that people reading here should not assume it's free or legal to use this driver. Many things can be downloaded for free on the internet, but most of us know that not all of this is authorised or legal.

Second - what I really don't get: you do a long explanation just to end with recommending a particular online seller as the easiest way to solve the problems with win10 (not shure if so much advertisment is really needed here)  - but then adding a speech about people having to preserve this, our culture. So what was the proposal again? To defend culture - to keep the game up running - is all about choosing the right seller? Or what exactly? To depict the 'quagmire' part of this culture? Didn't get the message but those last sentences sound ridiculous to me.

I'm not advertising anything, except my personal hatred for DRM, which regardless of your views, is a perfectly valid one. I'm simply saying, if you've just one affected title, buying it digitally is probably the path of least resistance. However, if you own many affected titles, most probably you'll want to find a workaround instead. I personally think that's pretty sound advice, but of course you are free to disagree. Nonetheless, I trust this has clarified things for you?

And yes, despite your seeming disbelief, buying games without DRM is more likely to ensure they are preserved, in the sense that they can still be used in future. It's something I'm personally passionate about. I mean, in the context of Disks which no longer work because of a removed driver, you'd think this viewpoint could find a home here?! Because if SC4 was one of those titles which never saw a Digital re-release and there are many such titles, it too would be consigned to the dustbin of history for many users. Which would make it hard for an active community of players to exist, a fate I would hate to see for SC4 especially.

[fantozzi]

In fact assuming something is freeware shows a ridiculously simplistic understanding of software licensing, almost everything is licensed for use, there is rarely any ownership involved. So what it all comes down to, is not whether you can obtain it without cost, but what the explicit licence states you can and can't do with it. Not being able to find such a licence, does not mean one didn't exist, in fact one would have existed, of that you can be certain. Many people will use the term abandonware to describe a software product, that is either no longer supported or available. It's another common but false assumption that just because something isn't supported, users can do what they like with it.

I'm simply pointing out that people reading here should not assume it's free or legal to use this driver. Many things can be downloaded for free on the internet, but most of us know that not all of this is authorised or legal.

Like sc4 custom content?

[mgb204]

If you mean to ask if SC4 custom content can be seen as widely similar to the licensing of commercial products, then no, they are chalk and cheese (not remotely similar).

Frankly though, this argument has no place here, it's really not related to the issue at hand. If you feel the need to discuss it, might I suggest starting a thread specifically for the purpose of doing so?

[fantozzi]

First you accuse me of promoting "quagmire" actions, I try to defend, you respond I'm out of topic. For real, lately you act as if you're on a crusade, Robin.   

But I agree, as this conversation is of no help for this thread.

Still I recommend not to throw your discs away, especially if they are originally boxed. They are part of this culture. In the analog times cover design was a well respected art, featuring artists like Andy Warhol. Going the way companies want you to go, so they can save some money in production costs (save their money on artist work) - really - it doesn't help to preserve culture. It's simply not true.

[art128]

First you accuse me of promoting "quagmire" actions, I try to defend, you respond I'm out of topic. For real, lately you act as if you're on a crusade, Robin.   

Can you please not? If you have differences with Robin please take it to the PM section or better yet keep it to the original site of the source of the conflict, not here at SC4D where it not only is against the rules but also very not welcomed.

Thanks.