SG Heliport problem

hakki · April 10, 2012, 02:59:03 AM

Nothing seems to go through the avenue on this heliport. Sims use the avenue to get to work at the heliport and heliport is working fine as an airport but nothing goes through that avenue. The same goes with the railtrack beside the heliport.

Drawpaths shows the paths are ok.

I've tried to remove all the plugins and re-install only AC Airports with all dependencies (cleanitol shows everything's ok)

I've tested this with completely new city on a new region with only that one avenue connecting between residential and industrial area. Every time I plop the heliport upon the avenue the sims cant get to industrial zone anymore and the 'No job' signs appear all over res. zone. Traffic query doesnt show any traffic on the other side of the heliport. It doesnt matter if I drag the avenue after or before I plop the heliport.

Voltaire · April 10, 2012, 09:27:52 AM

I'll need to refer this one to a transit specialist, as I have no experience with transit modding and Tage seems to be away for now.

Thank you for doing the diagnostic work

It may help to know if you run the NAM -- if so which version, and which traffic simulator?

NCGAIO · April 10, 2012, 04:23:15 PM

Quote from: RippleJet on May 21, 2008, 12:04:17 PM
SimGoober Heliport

This is probably the most anticipated custom airport/heliport so far...

SimGoober made the original version three years ago.
It was briefly available for download before it was locked due to numerous CTD reports.

Now, SimGoober has made bigger versions of the heliport, giving us 6 growth stages of it!

The capacity increases from 3,600 to 123,800, covering the needs for rather large cities.

The heliport is "network enabled" for the avenue and railroad passing through it.
This allows the networks to function without the pathfinders resetting the commute clock at the heliport.
This also means it is not a station, allowing train passengers to get off at the heliport.

Also note, that during and a couple of months after each upgrade, the network paths will be broken.
Thus, make sure anyone commuting along the avenue or railroad can find alternative routes to work during the upgrades.

The heliport even comes with helicopters taking off (those small red ones).
Be prepared for a busy airspace around it!

If you are considering using more airports recommend reading the whole topic.

hakki · April 11, 2012, 03:40:05 AM

Quote from: Voltaire on April 10, 2012, 09:27:52 AM

It may help to know if you run the NAM -- if so which version, and which traffic simulator?

I'm using NAM version 30 (Sep. 2011) with essentials r132 at medium base capacity and mass transit usage set to High/Euro. But as I said the problem occurs even without NAM or any other mods/plugins installed.

To NCGAIO: The point is that the NE'd avenue and railtrack isn't working as network enabled at all, not from the beginning and not in between the upgrades.

NCGAIO · April 11, 2012, 05:27:17 AM

Network Enabling

Transit Enabling

Read the topic on these pictures! - http://sc4devotion.com/forums/index.php?topic=539.msg134578#msg134578

The download is an original or modified? If using as a railway station will have the problem of Figure 2.

Try to drag new paths on the lot and see what happens!

hakki · April 12, 2012, 06:57:03 AM

Quote from: NCGAIO on April 11, 2012, 05:27:17 AM
The download is an original or modified? If using as a railway station will have the problem of Figure 2.

Try to drag new paths on the lot and see what happens!

I've downloaded the lot from LEX as it is with other dependecies for AC airports. Nothing that I've done to modify it. I've tried several methods to drag the paths.

I have already read both of those topics you refer before posting about this and what I have understood is that the avenue on heliport should be working as a normal avenue traffic going through it, so should the track on the side (I haven't tried to use it as a station). Is that correct?

Here are two pictures of the situation (sorry about the huge size):

Sims can't get to work to ind.zone on the other side of the heliport. Few sims find jobs from heliport and can travel there.

With railtrack used, there are 50 sims disappearing into station beside the res. zone and they seem to have jobs (I doubt that station gives 50 jobs). Still, no one is using the track or going to ind. zone.

I'm just wandering if there's a bug in the lot or am I just missing something here? Of course I can use the heliport as any airport without the working avenue and build permanent alternative routes around it but since there is an avenue which is advertised to be working I'd like to use it.

NCGAIO · April 12, 2012, 08:30:41 AM

Quote from: hakki on April 12, 2012, 06:57:03 AM

.... there are 50 sims disappearing into station beside the res. zone and they seem to have jobs (I doubt that station gives 50 jobs). Still, no one is using the track or going to ind. zone.

.... I'm just wandering if there's a bug in the lot or am I just missing something here?

This is answered in the first image RippleJet ... Lot is working perfectly.

To be faster in trouble try posting a picture with the trick drawPath enabled. (Ctrl-x). The representation of automata is not always the reality of the game.

Lowkee33 · April 12, 2012, 08:43:22 AM

The Marrast Stations do have about 50 jobs.

catty · April 13, 2012, 12:22:58 PM

The only other time I see the same or similiar kind of problem is when the station has been transit modded for right-hand traffic and you are using a left-hand version of the game (or vice versa) and the game simply doesn't recognize the route as being valid.

NCGAIO · April 13, 2012, 04:12:17 PM

Not sure if it is worth continuing as it does not appear again, so is just for the record.

The pack for download on the LEX is only prop dependence for AC airport functional. Just open the reader and already see that there is no lot or building exemplar_file to transit or work setting. So if you are not installing the whole package will have to be modified for use alone.

If you return to clarify exactly what you did to plop a lot, and post the image drawPath and consultation on the heliport.

Voltaire · April 24, 2012, 09:29:15 AM

Sorry for taking so long to come back to you, hakki... it's been an rough couple of weeks in RL.

I'm conducting some tests on this lot. The same exact thing happens when I build it... the avenue and rail drag properly, however no traffic is allowed to cross the lot. I suspect this may be a result of the SG Heliport being a multi-stage upgradeable.

It would make sense for the game to disable network-enabling on multi-stage lots, as a safety measure against breaking the network. There is no requirement that stage upgrades preserve the lot size, although the SG Heliport does.

Findings so far:
- the lot distributed with the X-ports v2 is properly Network Enabled (examined via SC4Tool)
- the game's Transit map never "colors in" the section of rails/avenue inside the lot, no matter how long you wait
- it makes no difference whether the the network is dragged before or after constructing the Heliport

Can anyone post an example of traffic flowing through a multi-stage lot, without switching transit modes? Note that trucks entering a seaport don't count, that's a case of one-way trips.

Voltaire · May 18, 2012, 11:25:39 AM

I've been trying some things with this lot's transit properties and come up with some promising results.

This is the original situation: the traffic simulator won't use the networks on the Lot. This particular screenie was from a later test, with the Heliport modded as a non-upgrading non-functional landmark - but the result still did not change.

Then I assigned Transit Switching to this lot and the situation changed. I'm puzzled why this works when Ripplejet's tests did not... so, before updating the package I'm going to do more tests. But it looks good so far -- road and rail traffic apparently passes through normally:

hakki · July 03, 2012, 07:59:51 AM

Sorry about this very late answer too, Voltaire, but thanks for the effort.

I started to think that the whole problem was just my misunderstanding about TE/NE concepts and after a while of my own 'studies' I forgot the whole thing. If nothing else, I'm glad to hear the problem wasn't only my imagination.

NCGAIO · July 03, 2012, 09:15:59 AM

Quote from: hakki on July 03, 2012, 07:59:51 AM
Sorry ....

.....' I forgot the whole thing. If nothing else, I'm glad to hear the problem wasn't only my imagination.

We all know that we have real life outside the forum but for principle if someone asks for help it is assumed that are interested and in need of response.

It only remains to hope that the time spent will help someone with the same doubts.

Quote from: Voltaire on May 18, 2012, 11:25:39 AM

I'm puzzled why this works when Ripplejet's tests did not...

Maybe because the problem occurs when the train routes pass through the helipad ... traffic going through the change made is not the same type such as this in the figure below ..then the result is different.

cp702 · February 02, 2014, 01:42:28 PM

Was this issue ever resolved? I'm having the same issue, and it's killing what's supposed to be one of my major rail lines.

b22rian · April 29, 2014, 03:53:03 AM

Quote from: cp702 on February 02, 2014, 01:42:28 PM
Was this issue ever resolved? I'm having the same issue, and it's killing what's supposed to be one of my major rail lines.

i recall many years back a friend and myself were able to get the transit in the heliport working. But I do not recall exactly how we did this. I think the issue seems to have something to do with the "upgradable feature" of the lot as Voltaire suggested a couple of years back. And similar to Voltaire i think what we did was give the transit modding a complete over- haul . So you have to have some experience with transit modding to fix the issues with the heliport i think. I could ask Z ( Steve) + the MTA NAM team to look into this further ( which i am a part of) . But at the moment he is quite busy and trying to catch up with MTA activity over at NAM.