Prism Tower Condos

[RadicalOne]

It's a large residential tower, housing 7100 $$$ residents. How did I do on the design? It's day only for now - I want to optimize the model before lighting it. One note: the lobby is unfinished.

EDIT: Scroll down for the up-to-date image.

[tag_one]

Great to see you over here Keisuke! I like the design of your tower
You can do some very interesting night light effect with the flame shaped feature on the top of the building

I see you use some dark textures for the windows so I suggest using some lighter textures for the window frames. This way they'll stand out more and add some more details to the facade.
You can also add some mechanical floors to the buildings. These floors contain HVAC units, water pumps, electrical switches and other stuff instead of apartments. Those floors are quite common on tall buildings and will add some more diversity to your model as well.
btw have you already experimented with the window texture tips I PMed you earlier about? When I read my PM back I realized I might wrote it a bit too quickly and simple. It took me quite a while to figure it out myself. So if you would like to have some examples just let me know    

[Diggis]

My main comment is it's very repetitive.  Some life on the balconies, maybe some open windows, or a person or 5 on the balconies would break it up a little and provide some interest.

Are they solar panels below the fin?  They seem a little out of scale, compared to the floors.  I would have them about 1/4 the size and maybe 2-3 times a many.  I like the penthouse floor (assuming that's what the double height is about ) but maybe having it smaller than the base, (either make the base larger or the penthouse smaller) would give the top better balance.  It's also quite tall, not sure how it stacks up in game, but it might work well if you do a base for the lobby larger than the base again to give it more balance.

I noticed your nightlighting over at ST.  The problem with it is that it wasn't random.  There still was a pattern to it.  To work well it really needs to be more random.  I'm not sure how you are doing the night lights (and I'm by no means an expert anyways) but you might need to do a few different variations for each of the graduated floors.

Good to see you here and I hope you have more luck with the advice.  

[gottago]

It's a very bold design, reminds me of cerulean's bats. I agree with tag that a mechanical floor would add realism.

One suggestion to take for what it's worth--what about adding buttresses that somehow echo the glass shard to the base of the tower, rising up about a dozen stories, to integrate the tower with the finial? They would give it a more dynamic shape and give you a more interesting, elaborate base to develop. Futurist Gothic, if you will...

[callagrafx]

Not a lot I can add except it needs a base...buildings this size generally have a "lobby" that is slightly larger than the floors, both horizontally and vertically. 

[RadicalOne]

A great many of these are wonderful ideas which I plan to include. This is a stark contrast to the first site - which I'm not supposed to mention by name, where 80% of the replies were "your building sucks"/"your BATs suck"/"you suck".

I see you use some dark textures for the windows so I suggest using some lighter textures for the window frames. This way they'll stand out more and add some more details to the facade.

Wonderful idea.

You can also add some mechanical floors to the buildings. These floors contain HVAC units, water pumps, electrical switches and other stuff instead of apartments. Those floors are quite common on tall buildings and will add some more diversity to your model as well.

Indeed they will - but how to externally differentiate them? I don't want an incongruous non-glass floor in the middle of the tower.

btw have you already experimented with the window texture tips I PMed you earlier about?

I tried it as I understand it, but the SimCity glass texture is rather poor - random colored rectangles overlaid on a small building from street level - making for a poor texture overall.

My main comment is it's very repetitive.  Some life on the balconies, maybe some open windows, or a person or 5 on the balconies would break it up a little and provide some interest.

That is an excellent idea, but how do I model people that don't just stand there, unmoving?

Are they solar panels below the fin?  They seem a little out of scale, compared to the floors.

They are indeed solar panels, and you are right, they are rather large.

I like the penthouse floor (assuming that's what the double height is about

I intended it as a headspace for the elevator mechanics, but that is an even better idea for it. I guess I can claim that the elevator is a LIM system, and use the top for something else.

but maybe having it smaller than the base, (either make the base larger or the penthouse smaller) would give the top better balance.

I'll try that. Are you suggesting a pyramidal shape?

It's also quite tall, not sure how it stacks up in game, but it might work well if you do a base for the lobby larger than the base again to give it more balance.

It's 60 or so stories, plus the fin. I will enlarge the lobby - that sounds like a good idea.

I noticed your nightlighting over at ST.  The problem with it is that it wasn't random.  There still was a pattern to it.  To work well it really needs to be more random.  I'm not sure how you are doing the night lights (and I'm by no means an expert anyways) but you might need to do a few different variations for each of the graduated floors.

What I did was array six floors - you probably saw the brightness wave pattern, which is 6 floors of decreasing intensity, then repeated -, delete a few lights at random, and array that upwards. It would take over three hours to delete them off the entire tower manually. Is there a program to do this?

One suggestion to take for what it's worth--what about adding buttresses that somehow echo the glass shard to the base of the tower, rising up about a dozen stories, to integrate the tower with the finial? They would give it a more dynamic shape and give you a more interesting, elaborate base to develop. Futurist Gothic, if you will...

I don't know about Gothic, but that is one of the best stylistic ideas so far. I've already got an idea in mind.

Not a lot I can add except it needs a base...buildings this size generally have a "lobby" that is slightly larger than the floors, both horizontally and vertically.

Is 1.3x on X and Y axes large enough?



OK, I'll apply all of these I can, and post a new image then. Be back in between one and three hours.

[gottago]

RadicalOne,

Glad you liked the suggestions--very curious to see what you come up with--and I'm stunned at your speed

As for this:

but how to externally differentiate them? I don't want an incongruous non-glass floor in the middle of the tower.

Mechanical floors are a fact of life in very tall towers and you'd need at least one if this is 60+ stories, mid-way up the tower. They aren't glassed-in normally but rather louvered to let air circulate through the hvac equipment. It creates a dull stripe but adds realism. Google some images of large towers like the old WTC and you'll see they are banded 1/3 and 2/3 up the towers where the hvac floors were. (The WTC towers were so tall they were really three buildings, each with their own hvac systems, set on top each other and linked by skylobbies.)

Edit to add: looking at your design again, why not enlarge the finial/shard so that it extends to the edge of the tower and its framing transforms into a ridge that runs down the long sides, and then flares out toward the bottom to become butresses?

[RadicalOne]

I'm stunned at your speed

Speed? Response time, you mean?

Mechanical floors are a fact of life in very tall towers and you'd need at least one if this is 60+ stories, mid-way up the tower.

Yes, I definitely would.

They aren't glassed-in normally but rather louvered to let air circulate through the hvac equipment. It creates a dull stripe but adds realism.

Louvered? As in external vents? That gives me an idea, one I'm borrowing from automotive technology.

Google some images of large towers like the old WTC and you'll see they are banded 1/3 and 2/3 up the towers where the hvac floors were.

I noticed those 2-floor (or so) tall bands. I wondered what they were.

why not enlarge the finial/shard so that it extends to the edge of the tower and its framing transforms into a ridge that runs down the long sides, and then flares out toward the bottom to become the butresses?

That's a cool idea, but unfortunately, it makes the fin overpoweringly large - but I have a variation in mind. I'm also a bit concerned about building footprint - I want to fit a 3x4 lot. Though that's probably a quick fix.

PS
Guess what kind of animal I have sleeping in my lap right now...

[RippleJet]

It's a large residential tower, housing 7100 $$$ residents.

I want to fit a 3x4 lot.

Did I hear someone just mention a CAMeLot?

Whatever the size and occupancy will be, let me know if you need help with the modding once you've come that far...

Guess what kind of animal I have sleeping in my lap right now...

Since I have a cat sleeping in the bed right behind me, I would guess you've got the same in your lap!

[RadicalOne]

Whatever the size and occupancy will be, let me know if you need help with the modding once you've come that far...

I have the .sc4Desc set up already, from the previous iteration of Prism Tower condos. Copying its occupancy, pollution, and other stats should do fine.

Since I have a cat sleeping in the bed right behind me, I would guess you've got the same in your lap!

I'm afraid you are not even close.

[sithlrd98]

I'm glad you have made yourself at home over here! BTW , really like the Hyperspace Garbage Disposal! Yes , you will find a few differences between here and ST! 

Jayson

[RadicalOne]

I'm glad you have made yourself at home over here!

Turns out I already had an account, and since I don't remember it, it must have been over a year ago that I registered. I thought it odd when I got the "username taken" message, and then I realized when I got the "someone with that email is already registered" message.

BTW , really like the Hyperspace Garbage Disposal!

Thank you. Do you know Pegasus Productions (Pegprod, Pegadyne)? I have to credit him or her (no idea which) with the inspiration for that. My cities tend to accumulate a LOT of garbage, and when I needed 12 of those isometric edge dump chutes, I decided to do something about it, taking the idea one step further. Ironic that it still partly obeys the laws of physics - there really is a fourth spatial dimension, though it is folded up to the Planck length (1.6×10⁻³²mm), and is thus unusable for trash storage.

Yes , you will find a few differences between here and ST!

Yes, this place is far better. The "high-level" people there spend more time "stroking their ego", as "CSGdesign" aptly put it, than helping others.


EDIT:
Here is the tower after applying the ideas. I love its design right now - it looks a bit like a rocket. The buttresses were added - in the style of the fin, a mechanical floor was added - with openings to outside, to allow the HVAC system to operate nominally, textures were touched up - though the vertical support columns still look dark, being embedded in the glass -, and the lobby was expanded greatly. The only idea I didn't use was narrowing the top a bit - it made the tower look a bit...off.


Noone has yet successfully guessed my pet's species yet... Anyone want to try?
Here's a not-so-revealing hint: Her name is "Echo".

[tamorr]

  Maybe an Iguana..... or a Parot...

I really like the change, and yeah it does kinda' look almost like a rocket. Very nice indeed. Also I'd have to agree that I like your garbage disposal Lot as well...

[RadicalOne]

Maybe an Iguana.....or a parrot...

No, neither of those, but you are so far the closest, with your first guess.

I really like the change, and yeah it does kinda' look almost like a rocket. Very nice indeed. Also I'd have to agree that I like your garbage disposal Lot as well...

Thank you very much.

[sithlrd98]

I don't BAT so I can't give you much help with that! I also know that one of the biggest things you were catching heat from was the top of this building and the fact that you were aiming towards a futuristic look. I am sure that you are creating this as much for yourself as to share. Just remember that you have other towers and some of the ideas/concepts given that could also benefit those. That being said, since this is a skyscraper , maybe tone down the rocket look? Also , since the roof has limited space , maybe use 1 or 2 larger types of HVAC prop. The spire/crown is a unique touch , but is there any way to give the blueish color some type of transparency? Please understand do not know what your skill level is , but seeing the garbage disposing BAT, I think you can pull it off!

Jayson

[RadicalOne]

maybe tone down the rocket look?

The look will be fairly subtle, I think. When this building is nestled in between others - which will hide the lower fins, the most rocketlike part - it will probably look fairly normal.

maybe use 1 or 2 larger types of HVAC prop.

I should put some HVAC units on the roof. Thank you.

is there any way to give the blueish color some type of transparency?

I tried that in the very first edition of this building. Apparently, judging by my experiences with it, and according to the Simtropolis Forums - correct me if I'm wrong - transparency works fine if there's another object behind it. If not, it will render as opaque, with the rendering background adding in the missing alpha channel, darkening it drastically. I was using software rendering mode in the game at the time - I'm now using hardware - and I had the glass either looking invisible - (<50% opacity), or opaque and darkened (>=50% opacity). Is this still the case? I would love to have the fins be semitransparent, as per the original design.

[SimGoober]

Well, if it is sleeping in your lap, I'll go with a Bearded Dragon.  Mine sleep anywhere I put them.

This is shaping up nicely, the lobby came together well.  The spire still gets me wondering though; is it meant to be purely decorative, or does it serve a function?  The framework around it seems very heavy; too thick.  I am guessing this is a decorative feature, and it should look lighter, not top heavy.  THe framework could only be .2 or .3 meters thick, and possibly a few .1 meter support cables... just ideas.  I believe this could be made semi transparent in game, but am uncertain as to how.  I know that some bats have been modded after rendering to make parts transparent, but have never done it myself.  Could be interesting...

[RadicalOne]

Well, if it is sleeping in your lap, I'll go with a Bearded Dragon.  Mine sleep anywhere I put them.

Think a different class of reptile.

is it [the fin] meant to be purely decorative, or does it serve a function?

It's decorative, though the framework (that runs down the sides of the tower) doubles as a sort of apparent reinforcement.

The framework around it seems very heavy; too thick.  I am guessing this is a decorative feature, and it should look lighter, not top heavy.  THe framework could only be .2 or .3 meters thick, and possibly a few .1 meter support cables...

I'll look into thinning it - I thought it was thick too - but the cables make it look cluttered - I tried.
EDIT: I set it to .025 thickness for the glass, and twice that for the steel, and unfortunately, it looks paper-thin, ready to blow over, and yet still looks too heavy. I think a bit of "top-heavyness" in the appearance might be the price I have to pay for this fin - and I'm prepared to pay it. All things considered, it is a fairly minor thing, especially since thinning it only minimally helped.

I believe this could be made semi transparent in game, but am uncertain as to how.  I know that some bats have been modded after rendering to make parts transparent, but have never done it myself.

My guess is that is has something to do with exporting the model, opening the .sc4desc in iLive reader, extracting the .fsh files, editing them, repackaging them, and continuing. Is this the case? I could probably do that, though I am dubious of the quality it would achieve. (If a tutorial exists somewhere - I'm searching with no success - a link would be greatly appreciated.)

[jmyers2043]

I am thinking that the large fin at the top could be a edgy, provocative in a way, extreme solar panel. The texture doesn't look panel-ish but that could be changed - if you wish. 

Also - the metal work holding the fin together looks like one large piece of stainless steel. Adding some detail like joins, flanges, or welds may add a bit of realism. If it were to be a solar panel... how about some wires running about or conduit etc. . .

I think that would give the fin some purpose, helps explain to the casual gamer what they are looking at, and make it easily accepted. 

Good Luck . . .

[RadicalOne]

I've put some HVAC units on the roof. A render will probably come tomorrow - it's 00:18 where I am, and, having put Echo to 'bed', I need to follow suit, given that I've been up since 05:00. And Echo is a 1.2m Corn Snake, by the way.

I am thinking that the large fin at the top could be a edgy, provocative in a way, extreme solar panel. The texture doesn't look panel-ish but that could be changed - if you wish.

I rather like that idea. Transparent glass is still my preferred choice, as it was the original plan, and seems more streamlined, so I'll do everything I can to realize that objective. Failing that, I'll try the solar panel look. It sounds promising.

Also - the metal work holding the fin together looks like one large piece of stainless steel...welds may add a bit of realism.

It's one unit, so welds are the applicable enhancement, but how to model them to actually be visible? Already some of the smaller details - like the small solar panels' actual cells - are too small to see.

If it were to be a solar panel... how about some wires running about or conduit etc. . .

The panel texture I have has the small wires, and it is certainly likely that in real life, the large wires would be inside the main steel joists. At least, that's where they put the lighting power cables on the top of the Telus building not far from where I live. (Light blue, dead center.) I apologize for the image size and page overflow. I don't know how to resize it with IMG code alone.